True Voice - Mohd Rafi
The following article was brought to my notice when Sharad posted it on MAS. The article has been trimmed down a bit keeping afloat Rafi details. However, anyone interested can go visit the source at http://tfmpage.com/forum/4980.6302.04.57.19.html
I am Swaminatha Iyer and I am 78 years old. I hail from Tiruchi and I am a part of music associations in Tiruchi, M’as as well as in West Bengal and Maharashtra.
I think it is wrong to condemn music or artists on either side of Vindhyas. Our Indian music is one of the few which has not been cleaned off by the western music though there has always been a influence. It speaks a lot of the richness of our music. Sometime back director of MTV had said that MTV westernized the music wherever it went but in India , MTV had to be Indianized for it to be accepted. A lot of this credit goes to the Indian film music.
I have been fortunate to have close personal association with Rafi, Sirkali, TMS, Dr. BMK, Kishore, SPB & KJY, PS, Mannadey and the one and only Lata Mangeshkar.
Comparisons are bound to come, but almost every artist or I have met considers Lata to be beyond comparison. Her talents are beyond anyone’s reach. Even Sirkazi used to talk of her singing like a die-hard fan as do countless others.
Now coming to the Rafi-SPB discussion. It might be difficult to convince an South Indian to believe Rafi is the better and at the same time Rafi crowd will never believe any other male singer comes anywhere nearer. There is one more mobile crowd, which is well conversant with Hindi and some south Indian language. Majority of them tilt to either Rafi or Kishore.
During one of my stays in M’as I had stayed with SPB. While talking of true voices he said, I don’t feel like half a singer when listening to Rafi. True voice is not a tech term but many in circle use it. Perfect example would be lata, but to understand consider our own PS who within her range is superb. People who do not have such true voices can never do justice to original. They generally underplay many parts of the song or fake it with bass/superficial singing. True voices make people like Sirkazi, Nusrat Fateh Ali khan, Lata… Inimitable. However since Sirkazi and Nusrat did not have the filmy voices their “real” following is limited to their local arena.
In addition to the true voice if the singer has a very good voice then in “most” cases he/she can better songs of others. It is this combination which makes Rafi stand out among the other male singers. There are many here who seem to have mistaken notions on a good bass and also on high pitch.
Bryan Adams does not require a monster bass in “Summer of 69″ to sound real manly. It is the punch which gives that feel and that is decided only by the comfort level in most ranges (that is by what your throat can support). This you CAN never disguise with bass. Since people have talked about lack of manly voice viz. a viz. Rafi it was necessary to bring this point out. I have had the fortune of listening to most singers in studio and some times without a mike, practicing with MD’s.When Lata or Rafi do, the level is so high that people hesitate to even hum. It felt silly to sing in their presence (and it feels silly when someone says his voice isn’t manly).
In RD’s tribute when SPB sang “Aaja Aaja mein hoon” or “Chaand mera dil” it sounded only sweet and lacked punch if you compare with Rafi’s original.
Yesu once told me God has been partial to Rafi. He said “god gift term anavasyamaa romba common aa ippo use aardu”.. but idu Rafi kee thaan 100% porundu”. This person could sing “as intricately as a lady without sounding thin”, “cover any mood”, “versatility odey perfect example Rafi”. Yesu said most important is the comfort level over ranges which makes you feel God has been partial to Rafi. (But Of course in Rafi’s early career (1950’s) the voice was relatively feeble).
To people exposed to Rafi’s talent, these or any amount of praise can only seem less. I just wish he was alive and you people could get a live chance to hear him. Probably you can get hold of the DD album for the Geet Gaata Chal series where the first four episodes were dedicated to Rafi. Rafi is on camera singing “O Duniya Ke Rakwaaley” and many other songs. If you see and hear the last part you will realize why SPB said “impossible”. I think particularly those people who have talked about scales w.r.t Rafi should see this album. Its a known fact in industry that Rafi ruled high pitch and there is no male singer better in switching notes so easily. There are artists who can go beyond but then they sound strained or they don’t have pleasant voices when they venture into those territories.
Many singers of today are his compulsive followers. But they end up inheriting only part of his quality. Md. Aziz ended up with a sad voice. Mahendra Kapoor with a thick nasal voice. Anwar with a nasal voice. Sonu Nigam with a feminine voice. Rafi neither had a soft voice nor a heavy (bass) voice he had a good voice. Importantly did not strain at high notes, and voice if at all only became better at higher notes. If you see him singing it will remind you of Janaki. However diff the song is or the note is he will be smiling and singing. It is unthinkable that he cannot sing something.
There seems to be lot of talk about “Shankara Bharanamo” song. SPB has sung many a great numbers and things being said about this song in this forum are rather amusing, particularly b’cos 3 out of 4 people who can be called as singers will be able sing it and at least one out of 10 will sing it with the same effect. There are lot of other songs of SPB where this great singer has played with songs in total control. You will find most south Indian singers who have had a good exposure say that it is beneficial to learn Hindustani as it gives better breath control and improves expression.
Rafi was not only able to glide over a song, the important thing was that he could express each word/sound when singing. It is one thing to hold your breath, start and reach a crescendo (high note), as like in “Shankara”, “Anbey (Yennai kaan villaye)” it is different ballgame if you have to do it from low notes or suddenly switch notes. With practice the former can be done, latter requires a special gift. Rafi had a natural ability to do the latter. In “Tum joh mil gaye ho” there is such a transition in the “karwaan mil gaya” part. I have never seen anyone do justice to most of his songs in my life time. In “parda hai parda” quawaali the similar part is “kar doon to, Akbar mera naam”. In fact most of his songs will have these specialty as it was his natural ability to sing freely in a wide range at the same time giving that extra expression.
Whereas SPB takes us to heavens with “Idu oru pon maali”,”Ilaya nila” “bisiladarenu”(kannada), when he sings Rafi’s song it lacks the punch or expression, though it has the bass. But at least most agree that SPB does some justice to original, whereas most others murder the original.
One trivial point I would like to add is that singing in Hindi is harder. There are more “JHA”,”CHA”,”HA”,”THA”, “KHA”,”JA”,”FA”. These take away the breath faster. The more expressive you are the more air you are using up. Just singing from Nabhi will not help, your throat also needs to do a lot, for singing in Hindi, Bengali etc. SPB makes you fall in love with his south Indian songs but same cannot be said about his Hindi songs. If you just glide through words having these sounds, you will never be expressive. Doing this as well as reaching high notes is not easy. Rafi had this gift and that’s why it is difficult to imagine anyone else in his shoes. Song “Chalkaaye jaam” has so much expression that it is unthinkable how anyone can sing it. When Rafi switches to a high note with “Mitwaa” in the song “Chaahunga mein tughey” you cannot replicate it with bass. Most others will sound as if they are shouting in such cases. That man’s throat had the ability to freely sing at such levels.
Versatility is not just the ability to sing in various styles, more important is how good you are singing in those styles. You have lot of Ghazal singers today but when Rafi sings a Ghazal you will sit up and take notice. You don’t have to be part of the Ghazal listeners crowd. This is one important aspect. Whatever style you sing you should be able to pull the common man to listen and not just a particular crowd. Pick “parda hai parda” or any qawalli and it will stand tall among other qawalli’s.
Variety is amazing :
songs of Guru Dutt’s Khagaz key phool or songs like abhi naa jao chod key, Aaja teri yaad aayi, Aaj kal mein dhal gaya, Aaj kal terey merey pyaar, Aasmaan sey aaya farishta, Dil ney pyaar kiya hai, Deewana mujh saa nahi, Din dhal jaaye, Duniya paagal hai, Jaane walon jara, Dil joh na kaha saka, Dil key jharokon mein, Dil kaa bhavar, Chalkey teri aakkhon sey, Kar chaley hum fida, khilona jaan kar tum, Woh jab yaad aay, Woh hain jara khafa, Vaadian mera daaman, Pathar key sanam, Chaand mera dil, Main zindagi kaa saath, Mainey poocha chaand sey, sun sun jaalima, Koi jab raah na paay, hum to chaley pardes, badan pey sitaarey, laal chadi maidaan, Tum jo mil gaye, O meri shaahey, Sau baar janam lengey, Tum mujhey yoon bhula, Tumney mujhey dekha, Terey merey sapney, Tumny pukaara hum chaley aay
Name a situation/mood and Rafi’s song will be there on the top.
Swami
November 21st, 2007 at 5:13 pm
Dear Haldar Sir:
Please see my post #590 and respond
November 19th, 2007 at 8:17 pm
Hussein ji,
Kindly have a glance at previous 3 to 4 pages in this site i.e pages 18 to 23. You will yourself know who ghantasala is or else go to google. com and type ghantasala. You will know . In a nutshell I can tell he is one of the indian greatest film playback singer (mostly southern languages in particular telugu language) wherein he reigned supreme in his illustrious career spanning 3 decades. As rafi sahab is to north, ghantasala is to south i.e. it hussein ji.
November 15th, 2007 at 11:25 am
Who is ghantasala?
November 14th, 2007 at 10:01 pm
Ahamed Kutty sahab,
The website titled project ghantasala is also quite active for many years and continues to function actively. I agree with your points. But some points I wish to share with you.
Recently, I had read in some newspaper that a temple is being built for rafi sahab in the west. That is great indeed. You know in Andhra Pradesh, (I could not exactly recollect the place, but I will tell the same shortly) a temple for ghantasala exists in which his songs are continuously heard. This has been arranged with latest technology. So this proves the similarity between both singers as far as the respect of their respective fans is concerned for both the singers. Even in the west, the telugu academy is quite active continuously every year and as and when occasion arises to conduct programmes and remember ghantasala. In Andhra pradesh, every year, ghantasala concerts and programmes are held on his birth/death day at many places. The details I will provide you as and when the occasion arises. Perhaps no other singer enjoys such popularity. Rafi sahab’s popularity is only 27 years but ghantasala’s popularity is 35 years old dear kutti sahab.
November 13th, 2007 at 12:30 pm
Rafians, get a glimpse of the aathwan sur in op’s recording room.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCyU2cNXjCs
November 11th, 2007 at 6:05 pm
We have singers who are masters to some extent only.Yesudas saabs “gori tera gav bada pyara” is one of the best songs in hindi.we will not be happy to hear such songs always.we have kishoreda who can sing maximum two or
three types of songs.we have mukeshji who also like that.then Mannadeyji
and Mahendra Kapoorji also same.here we can see the difference of mohamed rafi saab.nobody is having the flexibility what he is having.he sings
the great song “oh duniya ke ” as well as other types icluding for Johny walker
and junior mehmood.
other than religious leaders,nobody in world history brought any community
in any of the forms.but after 27 years of his death rafi saab became the
cause of a community”rafian community”and the members automatically
having some sort of brotherly connection.
personalitywise rafi saab maintained a very rare personality until his death.
one of the reasons he is having fans all over the world is the appearance.
he made people to sing his songs who do not know hindi or urdu.
As far as stage programmes are concerned, anybody can bring a programme
like his in Royal albert hall,london.Almost all singers favourite singer is
rafi saab.
Is any other playback singer’s(living or dead) web site is active like rafi saab’s.
we have no substitutions for his qualities.That is why we should not compare
with mohamed rafi saab with any other singer(male or female) as for above
qualities nobody is there to reach near him.
November 5th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
when frog got birth and came on the earth he saw a bird who was flying in the sky he tried to fly like the bird he tried a little bit but when he saw a dog he tried to walk like the dog as soon as he saw a duck in water he tried like duck and so on…… he tried every things a little bit so he is versatile but couldn’t learn perfectly anything and finally we see he is not able to fly, walk or swim. So Kishore Kumar is like a frog and Rafi Saab is like a lion
November 3rd, 2007 at 9:37 pm
Murthy garu,
I am not able to understand how you could carve out such a research. anyhow it sounds interesting. But i don’t hesitate in saying one thing in straight forward way. Whatever it may be, how can you compare these people (rafi ji and ghantasala ji) with Sri thyagaraja swamigal or mirabai, tulasidas, bhakt jayadev etc. They are all spiritual giants and any comparison would simply amount to comparison between earth and sky. So pl. try to understand and my request is don’t try to venture into areas in which we do not even possess the basic eligibility to think rather than make comments on those great spiritual souls. Hope you take my message in right spirit.
November 3rd, 2007 at 7:48 pm
Posts 582 by respected Haldarji and 590 by Anil ji invoke interest in me as to the technivalities of the voice. I am a common man who grew up listning to Rafi Saheb’s songs. I also recall my dad and other oldies praising KL Saigal saheb as I was very young then. The melody wise Saigals saheb’s voice also floated with lot of geniune feelings. Rafi Saheb took background singing to dizzy heights. No other singer, male or female could achieve that. I suppose this was because of his natural ability as described in 3D form by Mr Haldar. What range and with what ease he could modulate his voice and coming back from high pitch into normal singing in the same breath is unparrallelld.
You two are good at analysis, I heard Jagjit Singh on Star voice of India the other day saying that if the suction of a singer’s voice can be heard then he/she are short of breath. To me, this may be true for most, but Rafi Saheb does it on purpose in his hey days e.g; “Abhi naan jaao chhod kar”-hum dono.
November 2nd, 2007 at 8:03 pm
Hello all favourite rafian friends specially binu nair ji of rafi foundation along with all other fans and music analysts and lovers
I was really astonished to see this ghantsala and rafi comparison in the past 5 to 6 pages viz., many people quoting different versions and some balanced individuals quoting both of them as equal legends (including myself). To know the reality, out of curiosity and enthusiasm, i adopted a different technique, altogether different and generally beyond comprehension of human minds which I am describing here. My request is that kindly do not misunderstand and ridicule me since I have tried a new technique which if all of you read will appear quite interesting.
I have approached a reputed astrologer with the horoscopes of both rafi sahab and ghantasala ji (based on their date of birth i.e 24th Dec. 1924 & 4th Dec. 1922 - derived from google. com and their related websites) for analysing their talents. I am summarising hereunder the conclusions of the astrologer.
a. Both the horoscopes have influence of beneficial planet jupiter and mercury prominent in relation to the 2nd house (ruling voice) thus establishing melodious voices for both.
b. Rafi sahab has a mahapurusha yoga with reference to 2nd house making him famous globally even in western countries, whereas ghantasala ji has a rajayoga involving the 2nd house (ruling voice) making him famous and expert in music at the regional level.
c. The planet associated with music namely venus is strongly associated with 2nd house in case of ghantasala, whereas in case of rafi sahab sun assumes prominence. This indicates, the classical depth and training in music is rigorous and exemplary in case of ghantasala than rafi sahab.
d. Both the horoscopes have the 8th house and planet of longevity damaged thus giving rise to short life (53 for ghantasala ji and 56 for rafi sahab)
The astrologer while remarking said that since it is a case involved with music and two top legends in film industry, he also passed a passing remark to sri thyagaraja’s horoscope (who is revered as the first in trimurtis of carnatic music) wherein sun, mercury, jupiter are completely prominent in relation to 2nd house (ruling voice), The sun is not only exalted but jupiter and mercury are also equally powerful. The conclusion by the astrologer was. a complete divine voice directly gifted by god and fully capable of creating original and spot music compositions without any practise and only voice capable of pleasing directly the almighty. He further concluded that both the film legends voice, depending upon the strength and position of planetary combinations, do not even rank at least even to the 1/10th of saint thyagarja ji’s combinations.
If anybody could provide tansen’s horoscope, it will be an interesting case to study.
The above research may seem quite different, some may not even approve this and ridicule me, but as i requested and said, so much discussion has been going on in the past 5 to 6 pages, so only out of interest and enthusiasm i have tried some new method. It is for the fans and readers to take it either in optimistic or pessimistic way. I have written without any prejudice on any part pl.
If any of the fans/readers are also astrologers here, my request is they may pl. comment and give their views.
November 1st, 2007 at 8:02 pm
Ref: Post 582:
Thank you Haldar Sir for the response to my post. Your analysis of the voice of various singers are really wonderful. As you rightly pointed out, Rafi Sir’s voice is so flexible than it’s nearly impossible to brand it. As for the singer-actor combos I’m not as well-informed (as a south Indian)as I’d like to be. Still I am aware of the fact that Rafi sir did modulate his voice a lot depending on the actor. That coarser feel is there in Barbad -e-mohabbat as well as Dard-e-dil.
However I’d like to mention here that my idea of sweetness is somewhat different to yours. To me, sweeter voices are the polished, smoother ones (eg. Rafi Sir, K J Yesudas sir and Talaat Saab). The booming, heavier voices (eg. Kishore da, Hemant da) don’t appear to me sweet, though they have a beauty of their own. I’d also like to mention that of all the voices, the most difficult ones to ape (for me) are Rafi Sir’s and K J Yesudas sir’s- the combo of smooth finish going with a heavy base is nearly impossible to replicate.
May I request you to explore a bit further on the harmonic axis, Mukesh ji’s voice and Manna da vis-a-vis “gayaki” (Is this a tech-term?)
November 1st, 2007 at 3:13 pm
binu ji
points noted on this side also
may be a slight misinterpretation of ur statement
thnx for the warning , i ll certainly look out
but one thing what i dont understand is why those fake writers are allowed to write such rubbish!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
anyway sir I request ur presence in our community also
have a look and u hope u ll not be hisheartened
regards
November 1st, 2007 at 10:39 am
Post 584: Vasu ji..
god created many great things. i truly believe mohd rafi
to be god’s great creation.
this is a belief ’shared’ by many knowledgable men , I come
across.
i believe them….
binu nair. the rafi foundation.. mumbai… ( binus2000@hotmail.com )
November 1st, 2007 at 7:10 am
Aseer ji…
Points noted:
Orkut is a serious community , I agree. no ill will ‘ever meant’
aseer ji…
What I mean is that writers may please go to orkut , make a
community of their loved ones - I mean the singers and write
over there, their views. we will not be - bothered.
my views remain and i stand by it : that this is , ‘is’ a rafi saab
site. pl. do not make comparisons about rafi being inferior to
other singers here. it will be unending.
i too have my favourite singers and if i beging writing here , i
am sure of taking the confusion and disagreements further to
about 600 posts or more.
please get the meaning : that this is a mohd rafi site and please
keep the sanctity of it.
do not compare as mr.narayanan has observed; and be aware
of fake writers who come ‘in’ to create controversies herein.
this is the bottomline…
binu nair.. the rafi foundation….. mumbai…
October 31st, 2007 at 11:53 pm
binu ji
allthough we hail from different lands(orkut,mohdrafi.com etc)
we share one earth and passion is same(Rafi sahab)
remember freind the RAFIANs are one
October 31st, 2007 at 11:33 pm
good post nitish bhai(no 581)
Binu ji, I am again requesting u to plz stop insulting the true fans of Rafi sahab in orkut
we r serious community there and u cant find a single line of abuse there in the whole community whereas in this portal dedicated to Rafi sahab u can easily find insulting posts. Why these are being allowed?
You to prove urseelf a bigger Rafi fan is abusing others without even knowing that some fans in orkut may challenge the level of dedication u have for Rafi sahab.
What is happening in kk community is beyond our control but to prove our sincerity u cant even find a comparison based poll\topic there
Please refrain urself from making such comments which only highlight ur ignorance
October 31st, 2007 at 11:07 pm
Ramakrishna garu, greetings
Thank you very very much.
Hello all the esteemed friends and genuine music lovers, our earnest request is again to kindly pay small attention to our messages in 579 & 583 pl. This is make all people happy.
Binu nair ji, your post in 575 pl. I appreciate and admire your feelings about rafi sahab. But a small request pl. I personally feel you are quoting somewhat excess such as rafi alone, god creation etc. In fact you won’t disagree If I say that saint thyagaraja, the father of carnatic music, with his voice has invoked Lord Rama himself, i.e. the almighty. So your diction may apply to such great devotees, and certainly not to either rafi sahab or ghantasala garu. Both are equal legends in film industry and they will be like that only and nothing more. So my kind request is to kindly confine ourselves within our mortal limits while quoting our comments in respect of these legends.
October 31st, 2007 at 9:40 pm
ref post 579
vasu garu,
what an excellent & matured way of explanation. hope this brings down the arguements over who is the best & who is the second best.
if we consider music as the holi river ‘ ganges ‘ then rafi sahab is one edge & ghantasaala garu is another edge. the river flows swiftly taking along with it both the edges, and in my opinion all the rest of the singers bridge this gap between the two edges to keep the flow alive & make music ‘ divine ‘
i request all my rafian friends that let us not have any difference of opinion over this issue. in fact we are highly indebted to almighty that he has brought us to this world at that particular time when both the legends were making the microphones shiver.
one was ruling the entire south like a ‘ thick black cloud ‘ & the next legend was covering the entire sub continent like a ‘ cyclonic ‘ cloud.
and in both the cases the result was same. ‘ pure rain drops ‘
ramakrishna, hyderabad, 9949509592
sabnivis@yahoo.com
October 31st, 2007 at 10:35 am
ref post 577:
mr. cherian, very good analysis of rafi saab’s voice. You are right that his voice depended on the type of song he sang. But there is another factor: the actor he playbacked for. Let me start with “dil par hua aisa jadoo” from mr. and mrs. 55 that he sang for guru dutt:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=3_R0tsW5sig
He introduces more bass in this song than, say, the songs for Rajendra Kumar for whom his voice would waver a little more than usual. But if you want a heavier voice, try Raj Kumar; here is “sharmake yun na dekh” from neek kamal:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=sYnDrP3im9Y
On the x-axis, if you plot “heaviness”, talat will be to the farthest left and hemant will be to the farthest right, just a little right of kishore. rafi will be somewhere in the middle, with manna a little to the left. yesudas will be very close to rafi. But rafi’s voice could easily traverse almost the entire axis, probably stopping a little short of kishore’s.
On the y-axis, let us plot “sweetness” of the voice. Hemant’s will be very high, given his saccharin-sweet voice. Yesudas will also be very high. Manna and Talat will suffer somewhat on this axis. If you like Kishore’s intrinsic voice quality — which I do — he would also score well here. Rafi’s natural voice is very sweet but this is where he used to purposely vary his voice given the actor he was playbacking for and the type of song. People keep talking about Rafi-Shammi, Rafi-Dev and Rafi-Rajendra Kumar combos. But how about Rishi Kapoor? You will notice that he uses a slightly coarser voice to go on Rishi Kapoor; because qawaalis are the flavour of the day, here’s “hai agar dushman”:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=dLf5WPCniEc
In a 3-D space, you can conceive of a third axis, which I call the harmonics axis. There are only two players on this axis: rafi saab and a female singer (no, not the usual suspect). Now, if you plot the graphs, rafi saab’s voice will be an undulating hyperplane, shining in its sheer form, beauty and majesty, the likes of which you might see once in a millenium.
You will note that I haven’t mentioned mukesh. Mukesh is an outlier and that’s why he retained the perennial no. 2 spot; in short, he carved a niche for himself. Manna, being the closest to rafi in terms of gayaki, suffered the most.
October 31st, 2007 at 9:44 am
Binu Bhai….
even on orkut pages , such comparision is not allowed, at least not at the largest community of rafi saab on orkut. I wonder how so much rubbishes is allowed on this great portal of the greatest singer. 815 entries for rafi-kishore and hundreds of entries here, for what? trying to prove that rafi saab is greatest? trying to compare the uncomparable? have we any confusion about the greatness of the rafi saab, not just as a singer but also the greatest human being of film industry? if so , then for what such rubbishes is allowed here? just to proof that we are from a democratic country? There are a lot of great singer everywhere but greatest is only rafi saab.
but here every a b c person came here , righting so n so singer is better than rafi saab and we get involved in proving each time that he is wrong.
when these people did not understand the divinty in the voice of rafi saab after hearing him , then how could they understand after reading such arguemants…
it is my sincere request not to compare the uncomparable.
October 31st, 2007 at 9:39 am
telugu pride, maratha pride, punjabiyat, bengalee pride - all are
at work. all sectarians.. sorry for telling the ‘truth’.
this is a mohd rafi site and he sang in hindi. he is the ‘reigning’
badshah of music.. the sectarians have forgotten.
we are tired of these comparisons and raj from maharashtra
who visits this site in different names i.e. ashu/ashwini/ etc. etc
has again succeeded in ‘creating’ a controversy about rafi.
he is laughing , in the sidelines.
music lovers have again fallen in to his ‘trap’
we are tired of this . please stop this now. please visit the orkut
and write about your ’sectarian’ singers there. there is ample scope
for ‘it’.
Leave this site for rafi lovers .. please..
binu nair. the rafi foundation…… mumbai…
October 31st, 2007 at 7:23 am
All esteemed friends and music lovers
Discussions are taking undesirable turns. I feel arguments should be friendly, open and of pure thoughts without giving way to any unpleasant consequences as is happening. Myself and Sri Ramakrishnaji have many times stated the greatness of both legends. This should clearly set right all doubts. and another point all esteemed friends, i am unable to understand why some people are using words like blasphemy etc. Here no body is committing an offence everybody is expressing his own opinion according to own personal choice. After all tastes differ from individuals to individuals. And in my opinion as true fans and genuine music lovers, we should not lose our balance at any time. Some say ghantasala is great, this does not make rafi sahab inferior, similarly, if other says, rafi sahab is great, it does not degrade ghantasala. it is only the way of receiving/taking by people in the right spirit. i am unable to understand why some people (fans) are fighting over one another, when they (legends) themselves had great respect for each other as stated by venkatadri ji and others here.
Sri Venkatadri ji, a small correction pl. which i wanted to share with you. My father had met ghantasala in 1972 and spoke to him for 8 hours at Hyderabad. Ghantasala garu stated that when producers ask him to follow a hindi tune he used to follow it and he himself never had any interest towards any hindi tune. I hence feel your interpretation of copying/following to 90% seems incorrect. After all, A music director has also to keep the producers interest in mind.
October 30th, 2007 at 7:36 pm
Murthy garu,
I said Ghantasala that is my second best singer and I said it very clearly. You really didn’t understand it or have taken your liberties in twisting it!
I am very uncomfortable with misquoes and persons who do it.
Venkat
October 30th, 2007 at 6:17 pm
Since there’s been a lot of hue and cry about Rafi sir’s voice, especially comparing it with Ghantasala ji’s and Kishore da’s, I thought I’d (as some one who’s been trained in western music and who copies with reasonable success, the voice of most of our great singers) also go ahead with some comments. Rafi sir’s voice is not weak or light. It’s actually a perfect voice (So is K J Yesudas Sir’s voice). I request all those who prefer to think of Rafi sir’s voice as “not strong enough” to try singing like him. You’ll be amazed to find that it’s pretty deep and heavy (not too heavy and deep, though). It’s that polished top that gives it that soft and smooth feel. It’s the basic hevyness that keeps his voice masculine at those super- human notes (reaching up to d-flat in the 4th Octave). It’s also this heavyness that gives it that distinct punch in all those hi-energy songs (Dil ne dil ko pukara…, ni sultana re …nazar na lag jayee…and scores of Shammi Kapoor numbers), which’s lacking in a typical soft-voiced (gazal) singer. At the same time the soft-n-smooth top enables him to sing din dhal jayee..rang aur noor…zindagi bhar nahin…mujhe le chalo…and scores of other gazals as well as melancholic numbers.
To sum up, Rafi sir’s voice is strong when it needed to be, soft when it needed to be and that voice can be best described as soothing yet majestic.
October 30th, 2007 at 11:33 am
post 570 Sastry garu,
Once again u r comparing a carnatic music with hindusthani music which are sung with different style.
pl compare Rafi saab singing in hindi films with Ghanatasala garu’s hindi film songs [ should be atleast 25 songs } because a language plays a very important role in diction.
U must be knowing that legend Rafi saab was a school drop out and knew only urdu but still he has managed to dominate in the bollywood thru sheer god’s gift, hardwork n best talent.
It is a bonus for his fans that he has sung in various languages including english.
So Sastry garu no doubt Ghantasalu garu is the best in sanskritised versions of telugu mythological songs where as the same singer would not have been able to imbibe the various harkatheins, versatility, all types of mood based songs. Kindly listen to pyaasa, kagaz ke phool, laal quila, and innumerable songs even not so hit banners it is only Rafi saab who brings the best.
Also playbacking was brought in a new dimension as we can predict who is the actor whether is dilip or shammi or johnny walker or rajendra or mehmood when Rafi saab renders so perfectly.
So pl compare bollywood with bollywood and tollywood with tollywood only.
This is the view of most of the music lovers who love vintage music in my group.
Post 568 Aseer bhai
we are with u if anyone commits blasmephy..
regards